ICOM IC7610 : Radiateur / Dissipateur de chaleur interne décollé - Risque de panne #radioamateur

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ICOM IC7610 : Radiateur / Dissipateur de chaleur interne décollé - Risque de panne #radioamateur

Message  F5PBG le Mer 30 Mai - 16:18

Voici un défaut que je trouve étonnant.
Il me ferait ouvrir rapidement mon IC7610 avant de le redémarrer
si j'en avais acheté un...

Attention de ne pas abîmer les vis de fixation avec un tournevis inadapté.
Ce ne sont pas des vis cruciformes mais des vis au standard JIS (Japan industrial Standard).
Vous en trouverez sur amazon notamment (Hozan JIS-4 JIS Screwdriver).


ATTENTION : RECOLLER SOI-MÊME LE DISSIPATEUR THERMIQUE
PEUT ANNULER LA GARANTIE (voir commentaire VA7OJ)

Exclamation

Utiliser Google Translate si nécessaire :
After hearing another person on this list server indicate they had a loose heat sink in their 7610 I looked at my radio which I received in mid December.   I took the bottom cover off and found one of the heat sinks nearly disconnected from the IC chip it was connected to like the previous poster.  I secured the heatsink to the IC chip with a drop of heat sink glue.
Bruce - N0JX
I was very reluctant to open the bottom cover to investigate, but I too found the heat sink nearly disconnected on EP8200!  I placed my IC-7610 offline until ICOM provides instructions on getting the quality defect repaired.  This measure should prevent early failure of the EP8200 due to thermal runaway.
Very disappointed in ICOM's quality control program.  This is a very inexpensive process related defect for a moderately expensive product.  We can do better!
No, I will not be doing the repair myself.
vr, Kevin WA6JKN
I figured i would take my bottom cover off also, and guess what.
one heat sink was about to fall off completely and the other was half on and half off.
These heat sinks are very small and it would be very easy to replace them.
BUT !  , now A  little history. I was on the waiting list at a local distributor  in  AL,
and paid the full  price . I got the radio after a 6 week wait. and out no ware there
was a loud pop and and the rig quit .  Now if that isn't bad enough i find that the price is at least now $550.0  less.
the local distributor said i had to send it to Icom , after much arguing, and the stopping of payment  . with drove them nuts.
all of a sudden Icom in Seattle . called and said we are shipping you a new rig.
The new rig arrived and had problems stopping and having the tone problem.
which the new software completely cured.
now i find my new Flex 6400M has the same problem!!  and another problem that can only be fixed by sending it in.
I can put the heat sink on myself  (witch if it like the Icom ,should be very easy)
Sometimes i really think about taking up knitting
now i understand why  a lot of us keep the rigs that they had for a long time that work perfectly.
"Rich"  W9CIN
Hello all,
thanks to the group, I checked the heat sinks on my IC-7610 chips. One almost fell out, the other weakly held. For now, I exchanged on Thermaltake Memory Heatsink-Al for cooling memory and graphics cards. They are self-adhesive. I do not know what glue to use for gluing the original heat sinks. Maybe epoxide? By the way, temperature measurement using the FLIR C3 Thermal Camera. Without a heat sink of 70 degrees Celsius, with a heat sink of 60 degrees. Attached photos, invisible or will they be visible here?

Jonas LY1O
I received my 7610 a few day ago and opened it today.  One heat sink was solidly fastened while the second one was loose but not not falling off.  I did press the loose one back into place and it seems to be solid now but I'm not comfortable leaving it like that.  

My temporary fix is to slide a small fiber spacer tube over a corner "pillar" on each heat sink.  The spacers sitting on the heat sink are close to the top of the chassis but not touching.  Then I cut two small pieces of double-sided tape and affixed one side to the tops of the spacers.  I did not remove the covering from the other side of the tape.  I did not want it to stick to the bottom cover just provide cushioning to keep the spacers, and the heat sinks, in place when the bottom cover was attached.  Using a steel ruler across the edges of the chassis the height was just enough to provide gentle compression of the tape.  I fell confident the heatsinks can't fall off now and I doubt the single fiber spacer will interfere the heat transfer or block air flow.

Hopefully the inline pictures I inserted in my message, not attachments, will survive and you will see the two original heatsinks.  The second picture shows the fiber spacer tubes placed over a corner "pillar" on each heat sink.  The last picture shows the tape cushion.

WA2LBI
Well after so many comments about the Heat Sinks, I decided to take a look. That was easy! Found Heat Sink on EP8700 leaning to one side-applied downward pressure and was now solidly in place. EP8200 Heat Sink was solidly in place. S/N12001003 received 12/11/17.
Rich N7HD Prescott,Az.
Just checked mine #1898  One of them was about to fall off.
OK I just opened the bottom of mine. S/N 12001703 and both syncs were loose. One was hanging. I pressed them back in place and they seem tight, but I'm sure as soon as the adhesive gets warm they'll let go again. Question: Is ICOM doing anything about this? This radio is a month old. I don't feel like I should repairing it just now, nor should I have to!
SN 12002135 has been in use for 5 weeks.  One heat sink was loose, the other firmly fastened.
Bob - AK7S
Found Heat Sink on EP8700 leaning to one side-applied downward pressure and was now solidly in place. EP8200 Heat Sink was solidly in place.
I am curious, did you use the sub-receiver much?  From what I can tell from the RF connector closest to it, EP8200 is the A receiver's ADC, while EP8700 is the B receiver's ADC.
If you has used the A receiver more than the B receiver and yet it is the B receiver's heat sink has moved, the problem may not be a long term one, which is good news.  I.e., it is a flaw during manufacturing that once fix, is no longer an on-going problem.
   S/N12001003 received 12/11/17.
Wow!  This is the lowest 7610 Serial Number for the 1200 region.  I collected mine from HRO Portland two days before yours, and it already has a 1135 serial number.
73 - Chen, W7AY
mine is abt. 50 numbers higher and had the problem
i found something  interesting  6 hours ago i found one falling off and the other about to
i pushed them down and twisted them right and left a little strongly.
and forgot it till now  just for the heck of it i tried to see how strong they were attached
i was amazed i could not budge them  at all!
i could not turn them or lift them.
I think that the person that put them on originally    just set them on the chip and never pushed and
worked them in a little.  mine are on so strongly now i cant see them ever coming of  but to be safe

i am going to close mine up and look again in a month.
I just checked S/N 12001056, delivered the Friday of the ARRL 10m contest, second weekend of December.
With the front of the radio facing me, the left one was about to fall off.   EP8200.
The right one seemed well connected.  EP8700.
I’ll check the other 7610 after my sked at 3 PM MDT.
We need some feedback from Icom on this.  I don’t want to have to take the bottom off every few months.
By the way, several of the screws on the bottom of the radio were VERY tight.
Rob - NC0B
Yes, the IC7300 has a similar spiked heatsink on top of its ADC. Of course, most of the heat removal takes place via the pad on the underside of the ADC IC.
this pad is soldered to the PCB ground-plane.

73, Adam VA7OJ/Ab4OJ
I tested a small amount of the 3 year old Arctic Alumina (two-component thermal adhesive) that I have on hand, and it appaears to be still good, so I decided to pop open my 7610's bottom cover, and not wait for some new Arctics that I had bought to arrive.

The heat sink on the "B" ADC (EP8700) is still attached.  

The heat sink on the "A" ADC (EP8200) however, has lifted off and propped up at a 45 degree angle from the circuit board.  It is only attached to the chip on the one edge that is closest to the rear panel.  This could make sense since that is how gravity is likely to affect it when the front feet of the 7610 is extended.

As a controlled experiment, I decided to leave the EP8700 alone (I will revisit in a couple of months' time) and only reattached the EP8200 heat sink using new thermal adhesive.

Serial number 12001135, HRO Portland December 9, 2017.

BTW, the markings on the ADC says it is the "UP" version of the LTC2208.  The ones I have used were the "CUP" (C for "commercial" -- 0 to 70C -- grade).  So I can't tell if this is the CUP or IUP (industrial temperature grade) version of the chip.  Looks like a third week of 2017 manufacture date.

73 - Chen, W7AY
One heatsink was starting to come off with a slight tilt but still attached, the other one was fine.  Pushed them both on for about 15 seconds and buttoned it back up.
James Wolf,  KR9U - Serial No. 12002977
I opened my 7610 today and found one heatsink hanging by an edge and the other appeared ok but came off easily when I tugged on it. I didn't have any thermal specific epoxy on hand and in my past experience with small heatsinks, regular epoxy works fine within reasonable temps so I used some Locktite 5 minute Epoxy. As with heatsink paste, you want the most surface to surface contact between parts and the paste or Epoxy is only there to fill in any gaps.

I first let the radio run for 15 min with both heatsinks removed then took a picture of them with a thermal imaging camera that showed the peak temp in the middle of the chips was 160deg F. This was with the bottom cover off and the radio upside down, so I would expect that temp to creep a little higher with the cover on and the radio right side up.

I applied a very thin coating of Epoxy to the chip and heatsink and put pressure on the heatsink while twisting it to squeeze out any excess Epoxy to get the best surface to surface contact. I also placed some small weights on the heatsinks to avoid any gaps while the Epoxy cured. After curing I let the radio run for 15 min again and took another thermal pic showing the hottest part of the heatsinks at the base was 136 deg F. This should be well within the working range of the Epoxy and the chips will probably tear off the board before the heatsinks fall off.

I put the radio back in the radio room with lots of stuff stacked on and around the radio before realizing I forgot to record the S/N, which I'll get soon. I tried to post the thermal pics to the photo section of this group but don't see a way to do that.

Mike
All the heatsink chatter made me take a look.  Unfortunately the EP8200 heat sink was only hanging on by an edge. The EP8700 is solid in place.  Picked up this unit on Feb 12, 2018 from HRO near me.
Other than this problem, I've been very happy with the radio.  It was quite the upgrade from my old Kenwood TS-530S.  I'm mainly a CW operator with only limited time on FT8, RTTY, SSB.  I'm not "operating" using my iMac so can't speak to any issues others are seeing using those modes/controls/configurations.  Just pounding on my straight key.  The rig is powered up a few hours a day on average and I'm transmitting for a hour or so of that.  Also, I'm almost always on "Main" band, i.e., seldom making use of the "Sub" or dual receiver capabilities.  

I pressed the heat sink back on and gave it a minute figuring that can't hurt.  Guess I'll be checking this in a week or so to see how well it's holding.  Looking forward to an official ICOM explanation for this problem and a permanent fix.

73s, Russ  -  WA1FCC - SN12001724
Just checked and ep8200 heatsink was loose.
Then seated it firmly, with  applied pressure.
This is one you definately should check and correct if needed.
BTW you can't miss the two heatsinks once the bottom cover is off, nudge each one  lightly to ensure the heatsinks are firmly attached.
Better safe than sorry.
W4RQ Rich - S/N 12001769
I have SN # 12002050 purchased from Gigaparts and put into service around March 20, 2018.
The rig has been used for an average of 12 hours daily.

Upon checking I found heat sink EP8200 was loose as reported by others. The other heat sink seemed to be stable.
I firmly reset EP8200 and put the rig back in service.  Hopefully this is a minor bump in the road for a great rig.
I have not had this much fun with a radio since selling my trusty FT1000D a few years back.

73, Bob, K5BG
Reported also in other thread - serial number 12002157 has partly detached heat sink on 'A" 8200, but "B" 8700 still firmly attached.

Mike - AF7ON
Just checked mine. EP8200 was dangling by one edge and almost completely disconnected. EP8700 was seated relatively firmly. I pressed EP8200 back into place and applied pressure for a little while, but I completely agree with others that this will not hold. There is also some risk in shorting to a nearby capacitor if you are not careful. Note that the metal is very soft, so don't press too hard and apply pressure evenly across all of the fins. Serial number 12002217. Purchased in March.

I took a picture. Is there no way to attach a picture to a message?

Scott
AK5SD
My Icom contacts are anxiously awaiting my data, and in fact I have been forwarding incident reports and photos, but I have been advised on excellent authority that affected owners must not attempt to glue the heatsinks back onto the ADC's with epoxy, Super-Glue, Loctite or any other non-heat-transferring material. Any such action will void the warranty.
Exclamation
The correct way to re-attach the ADC heatsinks is as follows: CAREFULLY place the heatsink back over just the ADC (being careful not to touch a capacitor that is close to one corner of the ADC) and press firmly for about 30 seconds. This will ensure a good contact with the special tape that is now used to affix the heatsink to the ADC.

73, Adam VA7OJ/AB4OJ
My serial number is 12002001,has partly detached heat sink on 'A" 8200, but "B" 8700 still firmly attached.

73`s, Alain VE2WQ/VA2GZD
Another loose heat sink on 8200, while 8700 very firmly on. 8200 was still attached on the edge closest to the center of the board.
Pressed 8200 on firmly.
Unit is S/N 1864 from DXE delivered 5/19 and has about 40 hours on main receiver.
No other issues other than my post “7610 or Wsjt-x?” that turned out was a computer USB port issue that was causing the 7610 to transmit a spike at the beginning and end of each FT8 transmission.
The next significant data point will be when someone reports that a loose sink that was firmly pressed back on, has fallen of again!

Wendell, K8OO
Serial 1044. One heatsink hanging loose and twisted. Quick fix?  Question Exclamation

Pressed the sink for 40 seconds and stacked 2x10mm thick high density foam across both heatsinks which would compress to 15mm when the bottom cover is replaced. The fins do not make a too-deep impression into the foam and the sinks can go nowhere.

Hans ZS6KR
SN 12002272, purchased 5/18/18 at HRO Salem, NH. Two hours running time total. EP8200 heatsink falling off, still stuck at central edge. Reapplied with 60 seconds firm pressure. Also applied firm pressure to heatsink on EP8700.

Will recheck after a bit more use to see if it stuck.

Given that I have an affected unit, i guess I can now join the discussion:
1. The heatsinks are applied with some sort of proper thermally conducting adhesive. This probably comes preapplied with the heatsink.
2. No oil is ever used in the 'machining' of the IC's. They are thoroughly cleaned by the manufacturer. They are also thoroughly cleaned after soldering.
3. The heatsinks are almost certainly manually installed. The volume on this is not high enough for 'robots' to install the heatsinks.
4. From Icom's comments, it seems that the proper way to apply the adhesive is with 30-60 seconds of firm pressure. I suspect that was not done properly at assembly, and that insufficient time was used.
5. Given that EP8200 is most often the one that comes off, it may be related to heat from using the Main RX. Or maybe not.
6. Any foam used to hold them in place is likely to reduce cooling.

Tony, K1KP
Holding the heatsink on for 60 seconds did not fix the issue.  Any slight leverage will loosen it again.  I wonder if the adhesive has picked up dust while off the chip.
73, Paul - W4PGM
You are right Paul,

.... to my opinion. When I first realized the problem, I pressed the sink back into place,
but it was not really fixed (as yours) and "swimming" on the warm adhesive surface,
so I needed some elastic plastic on the opposite side on the cover, to keep the sink in place
by a slight pressure against it.
Otherwise I am quite sure, it is only a matter of time until the heatsink would go off again.

By the way, I do not understand people's opinion, who say, there will be no problem until
we notice a real malfunction of the radio: A loose cooling component reduces lifetime of a chip
and sooner or later may cause a serious damage (by short-circuit or overheating).
I think, that top-down adhesive-mounting of heat-sinks is gerally a design-risk, without
additional mechanical fixing.

vy73s Mike, DL1JM
I measured my ADC chips without heatsinks using a thermal imaging camera and the center top of the chip package was 160F after 15min of operation, which is 71.1C.
Mike


Numéro de série des postes concernés (liste non exhaustive) :
@12001003 12/11/2017
@12001056
@12001703
@12001713  2/14/2018
@12001769
@12002050
@12002135
@12002157
@12002272 18/05/2018
@12002977






A noter que sur la photographie du le site d'un OM canadien, cliquer ici , ces refroidisseurs thermiques n'étaient pas présents.
Les ingénieurs se seraient-ils aperçus d'un échauffement trop important sans la présence de ces radiateurs ou est-ce une simple précaution ?

Température mesurée par thermomètre infrarouge sur LT2208 de l' IC7600 sans radiateur : 71°C / Temp. ambiante aux alentours de 22°C
ICOM 7610 en fonction 15 minutes avant prise de mesure.

Ref.des deux ADC de l' IC7610 d'après VA7OJ :
LTC2208IUP - La température maxi est de 85°C.

Le datasheet du convertisseur analogique digital (ADC en anglais) LT2208 se trouve notamment sur ce lien (cliquer ici).
La températeur maxi est de 70°C ou 85°C selon le modèle. Je ne sais pas quel est le modèle utilisé.

Si vous disposez d'un thermomètre infrarouge (ceux des enfants, vendus en grande surface, disposent d'une option de mesure de
température des surfaces et/ou de liquides montant à 100°C), ne pas hésiter à me donner votre retour d'expérience.

A noter que certains équipements de la marque Flex rencontrent le même phénomène :
Cliquer ici


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Re: ICOM IC7610 : Radiateur / Dissipateur de chaleur interne décollé - Risque de panne #radioamateur

Message  F5PBG le Ven 6 Juil - 13:00

Voici la solution de Alpha Telecom que j'adopterais personnellement :




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Re: ICOM IC7610 : Radiateur / Dissipateur de chaleur interne décollé - Risque de panne #radioamateur

Message  F5PBG le Ven 27 Juil - 8:01

Une autre solution avec entretoises




Une autre solution avec un "bidule" en plastique
Par contre pas improbable que les vis d'origine soient alors un peu courtes.


mais pour ma part je rajouterais une solution équivalente à celles-ci dessus...

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